Jeffersonian Aristocracy

[joew]

rogesgallery said:

… Joe do you consider yourself a Jeffersonian conservative in the respect that you believe that a limited aristocracy is necessary to maintain the decision making process?

and

rogesgallery said:

… The reason I asked about your views as to aristocracy is that Jefferson was for it. That was the basis for conservitism, but the compromise was made in the provision of a party system. I see the neocon adgenda as a statement of intent to subvert that compromise and eleviate the liberal viewpoint. I'd like to hear your thoughts on that ….

Reflection on my hope for brokered conventions reminds me that for political entities larger than towns I do not favor direct democracy. The phrases I would use to describe what I think is good are "republican democracy" — meaning that the state is to serve the general good, not just that of the people in office — and "representative democracy" — meaning that representatives of the people are expected to consider and, in their wisdom, decide questions of public policy. I think Edmund Burke was right when he told the electors of Bristol that what he owed them as a Member of Parliament was not to vote according as he he thought they wanted him to but as he believed best for the country: he owed them his best judgment on the issues which arose.

I hope that the representatives chosen by the people will be sufficiently wise and sufficiently devoted to the general good that they will make good decisions. If this is aristocracy, it is a democratic republican aristocracy.

— modified to correct typographical error

[scotbrit]

Those are the words spoken by someone who has no idea what he is talking about.

The author would have gone far in Hitler's regime. He would be welcome by Robert Mugabe and Saddam would have thought a new prophet had come amongst us.

Is it any wonder that I get angry about the ignorant prat? He is an object of derision. Like Fox News: "We report" "You decide".

I think he needs to seek medical attention.

democratic republican aristocracy

The man's mad. There is no such thing.

"democracy", "republican" and "aristocracy" are at the extremities of the political spectrum. Check your dictionary.

[booklady]

Before I went nuts over Bob, I thought Francis Albert was all that. Here are some words he sang:

I got me ten fine toes to wiggle in the sand,
Lots of idle fingers snap to my command,
A loverly pair of heels that kick to beat the band,
Contemplating nature can be fascinating,
Add to these a nose that I can thumb, and a mouth by gum have I
So tell the whole wide world, if you don't happen to like it,
Deal me out, thank you kindly, pass me by.
Pass me by, pass me by, if you don't happen to like it, pass me by.

[joew]

My dictionary gives as the first definition of aristocracy "government by the best citizens." It is not self-contradictory for me or Jefferson to hope that the citizens of a democratic republic will, for the most part, elect such people as their representatives.

[rogesgallery]

I love it when you stick your fingers into these political threads Booky Keep it up you'll get the hang of it.

Joe It seems to me the voters of this country have proven themselves unqualified to elect the leaders best qualified io run the country. Besides that, where is the repercussion for a leadership that doesn't have the best interests of the people in mind? How can the people determine that the representative form of government has been traded for a game of toss when it is the centralized party leadership that chooses the candidates? I guess a game of toss wouldn't be that bad as long as the military doesn't get involved.

The first definition in my dictionary states: A hereditary nobility or privileged class. Maybe Funk and Wagnel lived in a different world than Webster. If your reference is Webster.

Just some of my thoughts, but in my opinion it is better to ponder the possible future than to pout over the past.

[joew]

Webster it is.

[joew]

An unqualified electorate is a major problem. We're obviously not going back to a system where people had to pay real estate taxes to vote. I think I suggested on an earlier thread that it would be good to have a test for voters similar to the test for citizenship. But that's not going to happen either. The best we can hope for is education and maybe some development in our election practices which enables discussion beyond the soundbites. Not discussion of the soundbites, but discussion of the candidates' full positions on issues.