Trying to understand the mind of a Trump supporter

[slb2]

Here is what a friend of mine said. I am bewildered. I don't know how to respond. Any thoughts?

Do you agree it is time for those clinton voters to get past their hate and move on to choose a good life? In every election many vote for a candidate that does not win. Americans choose the rule of law and peaceful elections over their wished for candidate. I cannot put into words how much I disliked Obama and what a poor President he was. I hold him accountable for the death and displacement of millions of beautiful Syrian people because of his reset with Russia, his poor foreign policy, and ignorant "red line" he did not enforce. He and Hillary watched 4 Americans die in Bengazi when it was entirely preventable. Still, we all behaved respectfully for 8 years and did not let hate destroy ourselves or our country. Dems are thinking and behaving so poorly they are not healthy and they are causing harm to the country. I wish for all children/people to thrive but Dem thinking causes mental health problems, physical problems, and a lack of self sufficiency such that they cannot thrive and give more than they take from society. Way past time for clinton voters to move on. Your FB post does not help those who are stuck move on. I want all to be happy and healthy!

[BoatBabe]

A "good life" does include happiness and healthfulness, although lots of us have good lives without continual happiness and perfect health. This stated severe "dislike" for President Obama is so drenched in Russian (and possibly other) internet propaganda re: Syria/Benghazi/mental health problems/lack of self-sufficiency attacks on everyone who may be associated with the Democratic Party, it is hard to process. It sounds like this person has Agent Orange Talking Points as a personal agenda.


My question is: Whatever stupid $hit you believe regarding Obama, do you clearly believe that it negates the current holder of the oval office of:

1. They let you do anything, grab them by the pussy
2. I could shoot anyone on 5th Avenue and no one would care
3. I like war heroes who weren't captured (John McCain) How many bone spurs do you still have, Sir?
4. "Russia, If you're listening . . . "
5. I need you to do me a favor though . . .

Notwithstanding the 18+ women who have accused him of sexual conduct/misconduct including while his latest wife was recovering from the birth of "her son," disparaging a Gold Star family, continual lies, dishonesty, running his presidency like his businesses (hiring contractors and refusing to pay them after their work was done, hiring illegals to work for cheap,) withholding congressional money to ANY country for his own personal/professional gains until he gets dirt on his perceived presidential opponent. It is illegal and disgusting.

[BoatBabe]

For clarification:

The United States House Select Committee on Events Surrounding the 2012 Terrorist Attack in Benghazi was created after Speaker of the United States House of Representatives John Boehner, on May 2, 2014, proposed that a House select committee would be formed to further investigate the Benghazi attack on September 11, 2012. During that event, the U.S. diplomatic mission in Benghazi, Libya was attacked, resulting in the deaths of the U.S. ambassador to that country, J. Christopher Stevens, and three other Americans.

On May 8, 2014, the House voted 232–186 to establish the select committee, with 225 Republicans and 7 Democrats in favor, and 186 Democrats voting against.[1] The chairman of the committee was Representative Trey Gowdy from South Carolina.[2] It was the last of six investigations conducted by Republican-controlled House committees. The committee closed on December 12, 2016,[3] after issuing its final report.[4]

In addition to the main report, alternate versions of committee findings were also prepared; another by House Republicans and one by House Democrats.[75] The State Department prepared a report of its own internal investigation of the attack.[76] The report itself found no wrongdoing of Hillary Clinton[77] in itself.

[doctork]

I think your FB poster/friend has drunk too much of the Kool-Aid, Susan. As far as "poor health" - having practiced medicine in red states, blue states and purple states - I can attest that disease and disability and mental health problems are generally equally distributed among Republicans and Democrats.

I don't understand the continued whining about either or both of the Clintons; I suppose it is a lack of genuine points of criticism against Obama. Or perhaps the poster does not understand that "Clinton voters" are not the same as "Democratic Party" Both Clintons are ancient history as far as US politics. Bill has been out of office for more than 20 years, and Hilary has never been elected to anything other than a senator from NY State, followed by multiple losses any time she tried for "higher office."

I did not observe 8 years of wide-spread respect for Obama from Republicans. Threats of violence against the President increased 10 fold or 100 fold (not sure, too lazy to look up, but it was a dramatic increase) with endless depictions of Obama as a monkey eating bananas, lynching cartoons, growth in white supremacy, birtherism, etc. With the exception of John McCain, I can't recall any Republican who objected to such disrespect.

I do get very tired of Democrats complaining that Trump shouldn't really have one because he received 3 million fewer votes, winning "only" via the electoral college. That is our system and all parties and candidates know it from the get-go.

I try very hard to respect the Office of the President even if I disapprove of the current occupant. This is very difficult to do given the way that President Trump publicly speaks and behaves, including all the points BB makes above. I'd add the violation of the emoluments clause, many appointments of unqualified individuals to important positions or failure to appoint anyone at all just leave the position empty, his crude language and his serious lack of critical thinking. He's also fat and ugly, though he can't help the latter.

IMHO, Trump is a disgrace to the office, given his disrespect for the office and the Constitution that he swore to protect and preserve.

[slb2]

To be honest, I cannot argue with her (my Trump-fan-friend) because it's futile. I rarely can gain a point with her even when I have solid facts to back up my position.

These people have lost their ability to critically reason and think. We are spiraling downward.

[doctork]

Half of Americans have an IQ below the median, not to mention all those whose prejudices are positively reinforced by Trump (many fine people among the white supremacists and so forth). That is one reason his support remains quite steady.

And there is no arguing or convincing those people, as their minds are made up regardless of facts. Election results will be decided by those few that are independent, undecided or otherwise non-partisan.

There were better qualified or just plain better candidates on both sides than either Hilary Clinton or Donald Trump. Republicans are just rolling over and playing dead while ignoring the lies, the adultery, the pussy-grabbing and the ignorance that Trump is so proud of, as well as the apparently illegal behavior.

[BoatBabe]

Back to the topic, "Trying to understand the mind of a Trump supporter," there is good news. I personally know 4 people (family members) who were gleeful Trump supporters and voted for him in 2016. I don't know when they had the Come To Jesus moment, but all of them are now so embarrassed, so revolted, so morally and ethically offended, that they no longer watch the news and shun politics because they just can't believe what he has really done (instead of what he said he did) as the current occupant of the White House, and what they have learned he did before he became "Agent Orange." Apparently they didn't know (or believe) that stuff before. They are now among the Anyone But Trump crowd. Hillary is not running. No one running for the Democratic ticket seems to be so offensive, except maybe the women, because we all know the historic transference of power: Better a black man than a white woman.

The folks who are still gleeful Trump supporters remind me of a story:

We were raising 4 high school kids in a house across from the local theater auditorium. One weekend, the local crazy charismatic preacher held a sign-waving protest due to a play being presented. Their signs read, "God Hates Fags," and other similar "biblical" quotes. These protesters offended our teenagers so severely, our kids decided to cross the street and go over there to have a discussion and find out what these people really thought, while presenting their own "My God doesn't hate anybody" counter point. We watched. It didn't go well for our kids. You can't argue, or talk, someone into thinking for themselves when they don't think for themselves. They repeat the talking points they have been taught and believe are "The Truth," no matter how many inconsistencies are involved.

Don't waste your time, Susan. You will never understand someone who has no critical analysis in their mind bank.

[doctork]

I watched and listened to most of the State of the Union address and it seemed clear why many support Trump. The economy is good and unemployment is very low. Many of the statistics of improvement that he cited were not false, and some were true.

However, the statistical cites reminded of the textbook "How to Lie With Statistics" used or discussed in my four statistics classes - one each in college, business school, medical school and MPH curriculum. Even if the statement is actually true, it may not be relevant, or an accurate representation of the truth. For example, if you are studying seasonal weather and measure two temperatures on two days in February as 55 and 60 degrees, then repeat a measure of two days in May and find them to be 60 and 55, it does not mean that the weather is the same during both months. Even if the facts are true about those measurements, and the average is "the same."

In addition to using only statistical interpretations that favor Trump, he used tropes that appeal to many, particularly such topics as "We are getting rid of illegal criminal aliens" and "we have created 7 million new jobs" and "we have added XX thousands of manufacturing jobs." Who doesn't want to get rid of criminal aliens, and add new jobs, especially more "family wage" manufacturing jobs. Who wouldn't want to cut those welfare cheats by reducing fraud and waste?

We all want more jobs, less criminals and fewer people engaging in fraud to steal public tax funds. But those statements serve as a "dog whistle" to those who are prejudiced but prefer to use terminology suggesting public good. The facts of net negative jobs in manufacturing (yes new ones appear but many more old ones are lost), the vanishingly small actual numbers of criminal aliens (numbers show aliens have lower crime rates than native-born) are disguised in those interpretations. Business is good if one overlooks the long-term costs of environmental damage due to loosened regulations. And there has been NO mention of the huge increase in the national debt under the current administration. Republicans and others used to think that was important - to us now, and to our children and grandchildren, and their children, all of whom will have to repay that debt.

Literacy and reading interpretation skills are low, mathematical skills are diminished, and critical thinking seems absent. Without understanding "the rest of the story" Trump may sound pretty good.

I did not feel that pursuing impeachment was a good strategy; in seemed to me to be a waste of time and money since we all knew what the outcome would be and the results would not change anybody's mind. Now it looks like the impeachment proceedings have solidified Trump's supporters, demonstrating that indeed "Democrats have it in for him." His popularity is at an all-time high.

[doctork]

Today when he checked out of the hospital and returned to the White House, I thought Trump still looked quite ill, especially after he walked up the stairs to the Truman balcony. He was using all his accessory muscles in his neck as well as the usual diaphragm muscles, he needed the pursed lip breathing just like an old COPDer, and he was forced to use short sentences with breaks to catch his breath.

And that is WITH steroids on board, the antibody booster shot, and ongoing remdesivir. I worry that if he crumps bad in the WH it could be very ugly. Even absent such a catastrophe, those with steroids and pneumonia (I am pretty sure that is what his CXR and CT scan showed, since the doctors refused to answer questions on the topic) are typical not capable of reciting the ABC's, let alone running the country.

And now he is free to run around home maskless, endangering all those who fix his meals, clean his room, and guard his safety. Worrisome.

[joew]

But, "Don't worry about Covid. Don't let it dominate you life. After all, even if you get it, all you have to do is check in to Walter Reed Hospital, leave three days later, and go home where your personal physician and a well-trained support staff who have all the medicines and equipment for any contingency will provide top-notch care, and you'll end up feeling better than you did 20 years ago (unless you're a loser). And of course none of this will cost you anything."

[doctork]

The White House staff who feel ill are being told "Don't come to the White House looking for help from us. Just see your own family doctor." Who of course may or may not have access to Covid testing, certainly can't provide it "for free," and likely can't participate in any comprehensive contact tracing or epidemiological evaluation program. Absent federal of at least CDC management such programs are run by each state/entity - and the DC Metro area includes DC, VA, MD, and even DE, PA, and WV.

The morning news featured story about impending economic disaster if the US cannot control corona virus. Our entire Pentagon leadership is in quarantine. The CDC has not been allowed to help with contact tracing, the President is not following isolation instructions and is thus endangering the 90 employees currently working in the White House, and their families, friends and any other contacts.

In Florida the governor has declared that everything is open, business as usual. I had thought that we could have a get together in Florida this fall to have a small family ceremony and scatter my brother's ashes; he died of "pneumonia" in March. Now I think such a gathering in Florida is too dangerous.

It is hard to believe that all this is allowed to continue unabated.

[slb2]

The abject poverty of the Trumpian mind.

I just needed to say that.

Responding in private to the idiocy of posts and opinions going around after the opening testimony and fact-finding of January 6th.