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Post by doctork on Aug 23, 2009 16:45:59 GMT -5
The Sunday talking heads had a lot to say today about Afghanistan, basically more of the same discussion about whether we can do anything, of so what and under what time frame, and if we have that money shouldn't we be spending it on health care.
I have had the same concern about Afghanistan as you joew. It has been ungovernable for centuries, in fact millenia if you go back to Alexander the Great, Babur, Genghis Khan and all the rest. The "centuries" part relates to time the west has tried to run the area, beginning in the 1800's. And of course the Russians haven't had any success either. The tribal culture and rivalries are very strong, and "recent history" refers to within the past 500 - 700 years. I started thinking along those lines back in 1969 when I learned about Afghan history and culture from Asian museums in Paris, and spent some time at the Institute for Study of the Arab World, also in Paris. Then in college my major was anthropology, and I studied the Kuchi people and other tribes of south/southwest Asia and Persia.
Still, the rising Taliban sheltered Al Qaeda and their training camps, and that sector of the culture is gaining strength again. Plus I've been there and seen the terrible health plight of mothers and babies - something that in many other undeveloped areas of the world has been quite amenable to change. Healthy mothers and babies who grow into healthy kids and teens really can change a nation. I don't think we can change Afghanistan, but if we foster healthy families (and primary education a la "Three Cups of Tea" and also agricultural development so the families can earn a living), then those Afghans can continue their own change.
I really don't know. My experience there has taught me a most important lesson - appreciate what I don't know. I'm just a westerner doing a little health education over there, a very limited role.
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Post by Jane on Aug 23, 2009 20:48:56 GMT -5
Fascinating article in today's NYTimes equating LBJ with Obama--an ambitious domestic agenda, an unwinnable war abroad that he didn't start but was saddled with---does this mean Nixon is coming?
A man boy from Grand Rapids just came home in a casket.
We need to be out of there.
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Post by gailkate on Aug 24, 2009 8:59:15 GMT -5
And another boy from Minnesota.
It seems we might need to rethink entirely. Maybe there's no military solution. While my heart goes out to the people K and others have tried so hard to help, is that reason enough for killing American kids? More tragedy to pile on the Afghan tragedy?
The terrain is unconquerable and the tacit collusion of Pakistan makes beating the Taliban look like an impossible goal. Maybe there are economic and cultural weapons we haven't fully explored. My pacifist heart has no mercy for the barbarians, but I just don't see how we can crush them without another Dresden or Hiroshima.
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Post by Jane on Aug 24, 2009 10:11:18 GMT -5
Many of those countries seem permanently entrenched in the middle ages. Can we pull them kicking and screaming into the present? Somehow I doubt it. And yet I hurt for the treatment of women and girls and all the atrocities perpetrated on the innocent.
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Post by doctork on Aug 24, 2009 16:41:52 GMT -5
I think that NGO's (non-governmental organizations) can do the health, education and agricultural thing better than the military, though they may need the military to protect them in the activity. Even Doctors Without Borders left Afghanistan, and they are the true hardcore who pay no attention to flying bullets in the vicinity. But DWB/MSF is also hardcore about their non-partisanship and being quite separate from military activities, so they are vulnerable.
If we are going to argue our military presence there, it "should be" on the basis that Afghanistan and Pakistan are a real threat to our national security, as that is the function of the military, no?
I saw talking heads referring to the NYT article and the comparison to LBJ, but now that I am a country dweller on snail mail delivery I won't get the Sunday paper until Friday. That's OK I got enough to do.
I do believe the nations can be removed from the Middle Ages - eventually. Given the internet and all the rest of modern communication, I think it's inevitable. Even Burma is starting to cave a bit. Kabul made huge strides between my visits in 2003 and 2008 - they even have electricity, traffic lights, movies, a shopping mall and restaurants you can go out to at night now. And city girls go to school. Out in the country - still the Middle Ages, and much of it bomber back to the Stone Age at that.
I think much of the opposition could be crushed by dropping billions in bales of hundred dollar bills - works better than bombs and cheaper too.
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Post by jspnrvr on Sept 6, 2009 6:16:50 GMT -5
A little change of topic. We're having an anniversary down here in my part of Florida. 2004 was the year we had four hurricanes hit: Charley, Frances, Jeanne and Ivan. Frances and Jeanne were our two local party girls, showing up within three weeks of each other. Frances on September 5th and Jeanne on September 26th. Frances was an excruciatingly slow moving storm; both offshore and after landfall. Slow to get here and then hanging around forever. I don't consider weather to be a spectator sport; I don't watch the Weather Channel and try to game the system. My wife was still on a walker, recovering from a spinal surgery. I had the panels up, the car packed. I had drawn my line in the ocean for a "Go/No-go" point; once Frances crossed I loaded the wife and the dog at 4AM and we headed up US 1 to our daughter's place in Sanford, northeast of Orlando. After we got there later that morning the deputies were going around warning people that we were sitting in a "100 year flood plain". So we gathered up all our grocery bags, headed over to a construction site to a sand pile, filled the bags and came back to start sandbagging around all the doors. More fun. After the storm passed, it was kind of like frontier days; I and Chief came back to check out the damage. The men and the dogs go ahead to secure the homestead before sending for the womenfolk. We were at it for about 10 days before we let Mari come back. We hadn't lost power but water came into the house when the roof was pierced by a steel 4x4, dropped from the carport when it did a back flip over the house into the screen room and pool. So I was afraid to turn on anything for awhile: AC, well pump, freezer and fridge, lights, fans. You know, the 20th century? Pharmacies were out, our local hospital's main campus was closed after their elevator units were ripped off the roof and water came in. The patients that absolutely, positively had to stay in during the storm, ICU and so on had been concentrated on the first and second floors before hand, then they had to be evacuated; nurses and medics were carrying stretcher bound folks down a stairwell. Just as were were starting to limber up and work the kinks out a little bit, Jeanne came back in on the 26th; the damage wasn't as bad, because so much had been blown away the first time. But Jeanne scattered the wreckage. Our local airport looked like an army base; all the power crews and Red Cross wagons from out of state were set up there, lots of trailers and satellite dishes. We even had crews in from California, without their equipment, just for the sake of keeping power trucks running 24 hours a day, rotating shifts of workers. I felt especially bad for the Canadians, those boys were really suffering in their hard hats and storm gear down here in the sub-tropics. There were rumors of "perks", however. Women desperate to have the power restored to blow dryers and curling irons were said to be making deals: "Hey, Sparky, want to have a good time? Hook me up!" I could go on, but enough. Our local paper is doing a three-day spread on the 5th anniversary. You can follow the linkys here, look for the "Interactive" for articles and photos: www.tcpalm.com/Frances and Jeanne, I'll never invite either of those b.....s to a party again.
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Post by gailkate on Sept 6, 2009 9:54:13 GMT -5
Jay, this is a joy to read. You have a great storyteller's insctinct. I'm going to come back later and go over it once again to get the full flavor.
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Post by doctork on Sept 6, 2009 12:10:42 GMT -5
Yeah, Jay, great story. I think you should sign up at the Swappin' Grounds in Jonesborough. That's where anyone can sign up to tell a story - you don't have to be an "official" storyteller with a union card and all.
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Post by doctork on Sept 7, 2009 18:00:45 GMT -5
I haven't watched much news this weekend. I did catch CBS Sunday Morning, which was celebrating its 30th anniversary. Has it really been so long? It's fairly recent I've remembered it's not "Charles Kuralt" anymore.
I don't get this whole thing about Obama talking to school kids on a TV broadcast. I'm not sure why he wants to do it, but I'm not sure why all the fuss. I mean he is the President, and it's not uncommon for an American president to talk or read to school kids.
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Post by gailkate on Sept 7, 2009 23:07:30 GMT -5
I think he's trying to tell kids that the old fairy tale of "anyone can grow up to be President" is true. All they have to do is look at him to see that color and culture and financial status are not essential to success. It's a tough sell, but his black skin is hard to argue with. We have school board elections coming up, and every candidate talks about two things: poor test scores and the achievement gap between white kids and black, Hispanic or Indian kids. Obama can materially affect that gap. But our governor actually said in his wekly radio address that the president's speech was "uninvited" and maybe having kids write letters to him was a way of collecting names for future propaganda. I'm so ashamed of him. Here's the text of the speech. www.whitehouse.gov/MediaResources/PreparedSchoolRemarks/
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Post by joew on Sept 8, 2009 18:57:00 GMT -5
As I heard it, what really got the uproar going was something from the federal Dept. of Ed. outlining a lesson plan in which kids would be invited to write something about how they could "help the President."
On principle, I don't think the federal government should be "suggesting" lesson plans to local schools anyway. But even apart from that, I can see why that might have sounded partisan. And the feds actually withdrew the suggestion, which calmed things down a bit.
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Post by jspnrvr on Sept 9, 2009 4:57:10 GMT -5
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Post by doctork on Sept 9, 2009 7:25:40 GMT -5
As I heard it, what really got the uproar going was something from the federal Dept. of Ed. outlining a lesson plan in which kids would be invited to write something about how they could "help the President." On principle, I don't think the federal government should be "suggesting" lesson plans to local schools anyway. But even apart from that, I can see why that might have sounded partisan. And the feds actually withdrew the suggestion, which calmed things down a bit. I don't know what the original proposal was, but the end result was pretty innocuous. I agree, I don't think the feds belong in education, as it is a state matter. Including lesson plans, though the fuss seemed to get that part withdrawn.
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Post by doctork on Sept 9, 2009 8:47:23 GMT -5
Gee I was hoping the mercury would be poisonous to the snakes! But in humans, mercury poisoning is associated with lower IQ, which may not matter much to reptiles.
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Post by gailkate on Sept 9, 2009 9:32:31 GMT -5
As I heard it, what really got the uproar going was something from the federal Dept. of Ed. outlining a lesson plan in which kids would be invited to write something about how they could "help the President." On principle, I don't think the federal government should be "suggesting" lesson plans to local schools anyway. But even apart from that, I can see why that might have sounded partisan. And the feds actually withdrew the suggestion, which calmed things down a bit. I don't know what the original proposal was, but the end result was pretty innocuous. I agree, I don't think the feds belong in education, as it is a state matter. Including lesson plans, though the fuss seemed to get that part withdrawn. If people weren't so paranoid and bristly they wouldn't get riled just for the heck of it. Those of us who can watch cable news any time during the day and evening have see the clip of GHWBush asking exactly what the "lesson plan" suggested. "Write me a letter," he said, "and tell me what you think...." Teachers given a video to introduce need a way to prep the students. Films I used in community colleges often came with suggested talking points and writing assignments. The better I got ,the less attention I paid to these ideas, but they helped me nonetheless. We talked in our offices and the break room about ways to use various films, slide packages, etc. And we never had to walk in cold and present something we hadn't seen. The lesson plan had nothing to do with "ramming his ideas down our throats" as I heard one woman say on primetime news. As you all know I don't have that reverence for the wisdom of states some of you have. The state may be populated with redneck brainless cretins. Some parents in states where the video wasn't shown had to keep their kids home in order to watch C-CPAN. We need to be careful about undue influence of any government entity, but the disrespect shown for the President this past week makes me ashamed.
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Post by doctork on Sept 9, 2009 10:01:25 GMT -5
We can certainly agree to disagree. It's not reverence for cretin-filled states I have. It's appreciation of the Constitution, which holds that all matters not assigned to the feds in the Constitution are reserved for the states.
Frankly, even the cretins eventually come around when they see the economic cost to their state of untenable positions. And I think everyone who got hysterical over this is starting to feel silly, no matter how much Mary Matalin tries to cover up (she looked pretty stupid to me this morning, and I am a supporter of the state's right to self-govern in education). I was really surprised GWB pushed No Child Left Behind. But some people want to be bristly and paranoid (including me and my concern about corporatocracy), and cable TV is an advertising/entertainment medium that fosters such.
I am a bit puzzled by such disrespect for the Office of the President, as I felt GWB (like Obama now that he is in the Oval Office) deserved that all the way through to January 20, 2009, even when one disagrees with him. That should be a standard conservative view IMHO. I suspect that some people just don't like one of "them" holding the office, and their prejudice comes out in a thin disguise.
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Post by gailkate on Sept 9, 2009 14:02:15 GMT -5
//I suspect that some people just don't like one of "them" holding the office, and their prejudice comes out in a thin disguise//
Yup.
What's left to the states is going to be an ongoing issue. I take the Preamble very seriously, so I see in it the right - the imperative - to be certain every kid in the country gets an education and the basics of that education are not up to individual states. Suppose some states effectively limited what girls could be taught. There are Amendments that could be used to challenge individual issues (as was done with girls' sports) but we shouldn't have to make a court case out of every issue.
I don't like Big Brother-ism either, but I'm fine with a federal interest in providing a basic education to everyone. You must teach the 3 Rs and American History. You must teach biology just the way they learn it in China, no matter what you may think about evolution. I think the corporatocracy would be happy to omit all the history leading up to anti-monopoly laws. They've managed to make everyone forget all that in the interest of the free market ideology. (And I'm not saying this is all Republicans' fault - Bill Clinton hitched onto that wagon.)
Education to me is the bastion of our freedom. It's got to have some federal guarantees.
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Post by kitehill on Sept 9, 2009 15:11:48 GMT -5
I haven't read through all of thee pages, but do you guys know that Garrison had a mild stroke? It's on MSN
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Post by Thomas Scheuzger on Sept 9, 2009 15:13:23 GMT -5
I don't know if any of you have heard the news yet, but Garrison suffered a minor stroke Monday and is down in Rochester at the Mayo clinic. He's lucid and talking, and has assured all of us that he'll be in as usual next week. He's still in the ICU, but hopefully will get out of there today and stay at Mayo until Friday.
It hit the AP a little while ago; there's more news there. He sent us all a note this morning from his laptop; I knew yesterday but was under strict gag rules.
Hopefully all will go well with his tests and things will move ahead normally.
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Post by kitehill on Sept 9, 2009 15:16:08 GMT -5
Hi Thomas....Rick just told me and I posted it here. Give him our best wishes and tell him to get the heck back to work but ONLY when he is given permission by those in the know.
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Post by liriodendron on Sept 9, 2009 15:27:27 GMT -5
Yes, do give him our good wishes for a speedy recovery!
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Post by doctork on Sept 9, 2009 15:51:52 GMT -5
I don't know if any of you have heard the news yet, but Garrison suffered a minor stroke Monday and is down in Rochester at the Mayo clinic. He's lucid and talking, and has assured all of us that he'll be in as usual next week. He's still in the ICU, but hopefully will get out of there today and stay at Mayo until Friday. It hit the AP a little while ago; there's more news there. He sent us all a note this morning from his laptop; I knew yesterday but was under strict gag rules. Hopefully all will go well with his tests and things will move ahead normally. Thanks all for letting us know. And I am very glad to hear he is doing well at the Mayo - he couldn't be in a finer institution. I speak from personal experience on that. I hope he makes a full and quick recovery, and I really suggest he follow doctors' orders about how fast to return to work. I know that from personal experience too; it's better to do what they say.
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Post by BoatBabe on Sept 9, 2009 16:50:06 GMT -5
I am very sorry to hear this. And my NPR station just said, "Garrison Keillor has The Writer's Almanac here at 2:53," which of course brought to mind the vision of him lying in his ICU bed reading into a microphone for our benefit. Macabre, yes; a little funny, too.
I'm sure he will do the things that are right for him. I hope you are feeling better soon, Mr. Keillor!
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Post by doctork on Sept 9, 2009 16:50:09 GMT -5
//Education to me is the bastion of our freedom. It's got to have some federal guarantees.//
Although this is the subject of much news, discussion and some attempts at legislation, are there school districts that have banned the teaching of evolution and limited biology classes to creationism? I have read of some attempts to require the two "theories" to be taught side-by-side, but I don't know if those efforts succeeded. Washington was not a typical setting for those efforts, but now we're in the Bible Belt, I'm not seeing this in the WV or NC schools. I really don't know, so this is an honest question.
As far as state inequities, I think the biggest problems are within states, as most school funding is through real estate taxes. Wealthy neighborhoods tend to get great schools, poor neighborhoods tend to get poor schools. When I've lived in WV, CO and WA with our kids in school, this has usually been addressed by some state wide effort at equalization of funding. Federal funding is only about 5% of national education funding.
Of course we've chosen to live only in neighborhoods with good schools ourselves, and in one case bought a second home in another state with better schools for one of our kids (ADHD and special ed issues, not curriculum content), so my view may be skewed. But honestly - we lived 10 years in WV with all our kids in elementary, middle and high schools. If there is any state that presents problem education, WV is a likely candidate. Yet we just didn't see girls limited, American history taught worse than elsewhere (though I could easily see where WV was much better than my own history classes in upscale suburban Virginia or cosmopolitan New Orleans), or lack of scientific biology.
In fact, we had two of our kids in three different conservative private Christian schools in two states for 4 years each, and they got standard biology texts and lessons. Religion class talked about creationism, but the biology teacher was a renowned (secular) national award winner and he did an outstanding job, including evolution. Being a scientist myself, I was on the lookout; I didn't see these described problems.
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Post by gailkate on Sept 9, 2009 16:59:41 GMT -5
Thanks, Thomas, I actually posted an announcement but apparently didn't hit 'post.' I thought MPR said the stroke was Sunday, but I was doing laundry and maybe misheard.
I, too, wish him the best, but I hope he sees this as a warning, a gift really. I'll bet his wife will see it that way. Somehow there ought to be a way to share hosting, cut back a bit, maybe just do the News. Let Pat host the music acts and use GK as a guest. We want him around for a very long time.
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Post by gailkate on Sept 9, 2009 17:55:20 GMT -5
As for schools, K, those were just quick examples. The most recent evolution flap was in Kansas, IIRC. My point is that we have to be vigilant and sometimes that means federal oversight. NCLB has been a mess because of the testing and paperwork demands, but I think the idea was a good one. Standards are valid, don't you think? We have the same funding issues you describe. About 30 years ago, MN designed a system of state aid that other states called the "Minnesota Miracle." Inequities because of tax base were supposed to be evened out with appropriate state aid. It worked for a long time, but now that aid has been cut to the bone, the old inequities are creeping back - not only in schools but in transportation and some social services. (That's really tough to analyze, tho, as wealthy counties need fewer social services. But we have much more demand at food shelves even in the wealthiest areas.) I think our difference is that I don't believe the feds should keep their nose out of education and possibly other areas not specified in the Constitution. In fact, I think it might be time for another constitutional convention. It just seems nuts to me (not you, of course) that people think the Framers had some sort of prescience that gave them foreknowledge of all possible circumstances that could come up in perpetuity. I'm not sure when public education became the norm in the US, although a Wiki article says Mississippi was the last state to enact compulsory education - in 1918! So how could the Framers be expected to provide a national right to education? Another instance - we've tweaked and pummeled our sturdy Constitution (and I revere it), but it's hard to make modern commerce and communications fit into its simple model. The reason the Sup. Ct. is now considering corporate sponsorship of political speech is that the good old 1st Amendment wasn't written by men who could foresee giant corporations owned by millions of people but run by a relative few. I just looked it up and the census in 1790 was 3.9 million. The number of WalMart employees in the U.S. is 1.2 million; one company equal to a third of the population in 1787. Our corporate giants equal the wealth and power of whole countries in their day. Of course, if we had another Con-Con we'd be Balkanized in a matter of weeks, so never mind.
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Post by jspnrvr on Sept 9, 2009 21:14:59 GMT -5
I don't know if any of you have heard the news yet, but Garrison suffered a minor stroke Monday and is down in Rochester at the Mayo clinic. He's lucid and talking, and has assured all of us that he'll be in as usual next week. He's still in the ICU, but hopefully will get out of there today and stay at Mayo until Friday. It hit the AP a little while ago; there's more news there. He sent us all a note this morning from his laptop; I knew yesterday but was under strict gag rules. Hopefully all will go well with his tests and things will move ahead normally. I was out earlier this evening an missed out on this. Thanks, Thomas for filling us in. He'll be in my prayers.
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Post by joew on Sept 9, 2009 23:56:39 GMT -5
I don't know if any of you have heard the news yet, but Garrison suffered a minor stroke Monday and is down in Rochester at the Mayo clinic. He's lucid and talking, and has assured all of us that he'll be in as usual next week. He's still in the ICU, but hopefully will get out of there today and stay at Mayo until Friday. It hit the AP a little while ago; there's more news there. He sent us all a note this morning from his laptop; I knew yesterday but was under strict gag rules. Hopefully all will go well with his tests and things will move ahead normally. My best wishes to Garrison for a full and speedy recovery.
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Post by doctork on Sept 10, 2009 7:47:42 GMT -5
// Standards are valid, don't you think?//
Sure. I just don't think the feds need to set state educational standards. The feds are plenty busy with national defense, foreign affairs and finance/treasury issues which do require attention on a national level. Overall, states seem to manage education fairly well, and where there are problems, it is not due to federal inattention.
Federal attention is needed in healthcare because we face life-threatening issues daily, which the states have been unsuccessful at addressing for 50 - 60 years. I never thought I would say that, but the last few years have convinced me, along with the success of Medicare, that pesky federal program that many want the government to "keep their hands off!"
Mostly I think government has too much of a tendency to self-perpetuate and enlarge for its own interests (for example, decades to cancel that multi-billion $$ bomber program that nobody wanted except a few Congressmen), and to be the tool of corporate interests with money and power. That is easier to monitor and manage on a state level.
The first amendment issue and campaign finance - both sides have meritorious arguments; I don't know the "right" answer.
Good idea to start a separate thread for GK too. I bet he would be surprised how much us dopey cronies still care about him!
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Post by doctork on Dec 3, 2009 10:39:47 GMT -5
This was of course the opening story on the Today Show this morning, not a promising setting for unbiased reporting. I have been generally concerned about excessive consolidation of the media, because it is apparent when there are only three or four mega-corporations controlling vast swaths of the "news and entertainment industries" (and I put them in one phrase because I believe they are widely conflated as part of the dumbing down of America), we don't get an accurate picture. So this was in my In-Box this morning. I am still reading, learning and digesting. what do you think? //Dear Kristin, Cable giant Comcast and NBC Universal have just announced that they're merging to form one of the most powerful media companies in the world. Washington and Wall Street are already saying this mega-merger is a done deal. If we don’t act now to stop it, we’ll have even more corporate control of our media, higher prices and fewer choices. It’s a marriage made in hell, and we need a citizens’ uprising to stop the merger. Join the Uprising Against the Mega-Merger Help us get 100,000 people to tell President Obama to make good on his campaign pledge to act "against the excessive concentration of [media] power in the hands of any one corporation, interest or small group." It’s time for the president to keep his promise. Sign our call to action — and we will deliver your demands to the president, as well as to decision makers at the Department of Justice, Federal Trade Commission and Federal Communications Commission who have the power to stop this merger. Comcast, the nation’s largest cable company and the second largest Internet provider, would merge with one of the world’s biggest producers of TV shows and movies. Here’s what this merger would mean for you: * Higher Prices: With Comcast in control of everything from MSNBC, Bravo and E! to Universal Pictures, they’ll be able to raise prices for their competitors that will be passed on to you. * Fewer Choices: Comcast would have a near-media monopoly in some communities, controlling cable and Internet access as well as local TV stations. They could push NBC shows ahead of other local and independent voices and programs, making it even harder to find alternatives on cable. * Less Innovation: This merged goliath could control what you watch and how you watch it, starving online video competitors or making you subscribe to Comcast to watch TV on the Internet. This merger is a dangerous attempt by media moguls to seize control of both media content and distribution, and to use this control to squeeze consumers. Stop the Merger: Join us at FreePress.net/Comcast With your help, we can give consumers a voice and keep this doomed marriage from ever reaching the altar. Thanks, Josh Silver Free Press www.freepress.netP.S. We need as many people to speak out as possible. Spread the word on Facebook or Twitter or forward this e-mail to your friends. We’d love to hear from them, too! Forwarded this message? You can also join our E-Activist list. Want to learn more? Join us on Facebook and follow us on Twitter.//
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